World
UK facilitates first ever Somaliland-Somalia direct talks
June 18, 2012 · 73 Comments
ADDIS ABABA — In a breakthrough development, Somaliland and Somalia are set to initiate first formal talks on intricate bilateral issues in an effort to finally end the saber-rattling between the two nations, Somalilandpress reports.
The strategic dialogue was first proposed by the British government during a conference on Somalia held in London on 23 February 2012. The final communiqué recognized the need for negotiations between Hargeisa and Mogadishu “in order to clarify their future relations.”
The British government said it was offering its mediation services and an attempt to officially get the two sides to the negotiation table for the first time in two decades is currently underway. The meeting is scheduled for this Wednesday in the British capital and will be closely monitored by key international players.
Somaliland has designated a team of five-members and they departed from the seaport town of Berbera on Sunday afternoon for London. The representatives consist of senior officials from the government, parliament and the opposition.
Headed by the foreign minister, Dr Mohamed Abdullahi Omar, the Somaliland team is tasked to campaign for the path towards self-determination and diplomatic recognition—based on pre-July 1960 borders.
This was reiterated by Dr Omar saying there was only one resulting possibility for them in the talks—a full international recognition—and that Somaliland would continue on its way. He stated that Somaliland statehood has both historical solid support and it was collective rights.
“We should maintain our dignity as an independent nation, deserving of international respect. Our sovereignty is non-negotiable,” Dr Omar said during a press briefing in Hargeisa.
Somaliland said the team it has nominated reflects its serious interest in the talks to settle its diplomatic standoff with Mogadishu over its status quo. Somaliland minister of information Abdulrahman Yusuf Duale had some tough words for Somalia Thursday, saying regarding reunification that “the gap between Somaliland and Somalia is like the sky and earth”.
He said if Somalia came to the table unconditionally, the talks will focus on three main agendas; to accept each nation’s statehood, establish bilateral relations and to address future cooperation.
On the other side of this coin, officials in Mogadishu have said in the run-up to the meeting that they hoped the meeting will bear fruits for the Somali people. According to sources in the Somali capital, the transitional federal government has indicated openness on all disputed issues.
The Somali President Sheikh Sharif Ahmed has reportedly called on his government to take proper measures to build Somaliland’s confidence. He is said to have proposed an interim federation system for reunification. Somalia still considers Somaliland to be one of its regions despite the fact that the two existed apart for the last twenty years.
The sources said Mr Ahmed has further called for the acknowledgement of Somalia’s past mistakes including the massacres of more than 50,000 Somalilanders by Somalia’s last central government between 1988 and 1991.
The President cited the need to enter into a new strategy of non-aggression and joint-exploration pact with Hargeisa according to media in Somalia.
The transitional federal government, whose term expires in August, is yet to assemble a negotiation team on their behave for the direct talks. This has already signaled to Hargeisa, Mogadishu’s lack of commitment and transparency. Their previous teams have caused Somaliland to pull out of the talks. Why they delayed to the last minute is worrisome for Dr. Omar’s team.
Somaliland continues to recover from decades of poverty, oppression and a devastating war with Somalia that has destroyed over 90 percent of major towns and cities. It maintains that it is a sovereign nation that temporarily entered a never rectified union with its much larger southern neighbor in 1960.
Somaliland not only meets the Montevideo Convention on the Rights and Duties of States including government, permanent population and defined territory but it also enjoys independence.
Hargeisa has its own issues too including the growing opposition in parts of its own regions that it claims falls within its territorial border as during colonial period. Communities in parts of eastern Sanaag and Sool region remain restive to Somaliland’s unilaterally declaration of independence.
Local Harti clans fear that the government in Hargeisa simply wants to impose its will on Harti-majority areas rather than engaging with them as Somaliland citizens equal under the law. Hargeisa not only needs to address Harti concerns but also turn a corner and not make the same mistake as Mogadishu. It should assert its legitimate right over all its territories within its borders without force or isolating any community.
If talks fail, Somaliland believes new avenues will surely become available for them to enable them to pursue legal remedies against Somalia in various international fora.
It argues that prior to its unification with Somalia in July 1960, Somaliland was a recognized nation by 34 states where as Somalia came under trusteeship of the UN. At that time, the international community regarded Somalia unfit to govern itself and the UN was entrusted to administer the area until it achieved independence in 1970.
The UN mandate was terminated when Somaliland requested that Somalia be given independence so the two could unify under the banner of “The Somali Republic”. From the beginning, Hargeisa felt it was hijacked and that it got the short end of the stick in the union. It hopes to avoid repeating the same mistake during these new diplomatic talks.
Along with the foreign minister, the Somaliland team includes Bashe Mohamed Farah, first deputy speaker of house of representatives, Faisal Ali Warabe, chairman of opposition Ucid party, Hersi H. Ali Hassan, minister for presidency and Mohamud Ahmed Barre, minister of labour and social affairs.
Somalilandpress
June 18, 2012
Follow @somalilandpressTags: Diplomatic talks, federalism, Harti clan, Independence, Recognition, Somalia, Somaliland news, UK, Unity
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Even though I support divided Greater Somalia, talks good. We can't forever hate each other because we want to be divided.
The article is well balanced and fair. Negotiation, dialogue and regular meetings are the only means to move us, Somali people, forward especially when we speak one common language. I welcome the dialogue, it appears finally Hargeisa understands the toll of isolation. It's good to engage even with those you don't agree with. What do you get out off sitting there?
@Kayse
I am interested to know more about what you mean toll of isolation?
the cost of isolation.
it is english
I think I got that
The two countries need to redraw their borders and agree to coexist. I know Mogadishu will not accept even if Somaliland compromised and sacrificed a lot because at the end of the day, Xamar does not want to be alone with central Somalis without its Hargeisa brothers. A Somalia without Hargeisa, Burco, Berbera, is not a Somalia.
I ssaq could have done exactly what the tutsi did in Rwanda after the genocide there which's taking over the country after the collapse of Barre regime and that's what the political elite (Egal, Tuur and others) wanted but people got emotional. Anyone is free to correct me but i have no doubt if (and this just an example) german tax payers had the choice they wouldn't pay billions of euros to Greece and to the euro zone. There's no such thing as "people wants" even in real democracies.
I absolutely agree, south and central Somalia will not co-exist without the rest of the country.
I can picture the scene:
Somaliland: We would like you to accept our sovereignty and give us recognition
Somalia: You are our dear brothers and we do not want you to leave us
International Community: How about meeting halfway!
kkkkkkkk
thus is funny.
mr waraabe: no! we r not brothers! ethiopia is more our brothers
somalia: ethiopia they r eer er we cant say it the IC is here
IC: what about some kind of autonomy?
Warabe: what is autonomy acuud?
IC: it is like they will leave you alone eh less interference
Warabe:that is great!
other somalilander : nooooooooo warabe!!!
Somalia: raa;li ka ahaada waxii dhacay 4.5 ka waxaa qaadatiin 1.0
somaliland: no we want powersharing 50/50
somalia: is that like 2.25 sland and 2.25 somalia = 4.5?
sland:uh
somalia:ok
somalia meets up and decides power sharing is no 6.75!!!!!!!! rather than 4.50 kkkkkkk
Loool you know I could only see when outcome ' SOMALILAND WALKS OUT AT THE MEETING'
As they state somalia's proposal is in logical and lacks clarity.. See you at the next meeting in ADDIS ABABA..
Unlogical..
Abdi R.
I mean do you think just protesting inside a cell will gain anyone anything? Somaliland has no foreign policy what so ever nor diplomatic strategies. Its like a little kid refusing to play with the other kids because they bigger or stronger.
You cant claim to be a state yet isolate yourself, you have an obligation whether you like it or not to even engage with those who wish to nuke you. For example Israel explores all channels with Iran.
I will refrain from using strong language because I have signed a secret deal with the devil hahahaha…I can't guarantee it will last though because I am strongly against Silaanyo regime. However, I will honor my side of the deal for now.
Somaliland successive governments had always kept saying that they would have a concrete dialogue with Somalia when a unified and representative government comes out of the current chaos and continuous political nightmares. Hence, there had been no proper governments in Somalia for the last 20 years that Somaliland governments could talk to and I personally believe there is no reliable one even at this moment. So, Somaliland had never isolated itself from having a fruitful and meaningful talks with Somalia
Anyway, let us wait and see what comes out of the proposed talks.
I got your point
The UK, EU and Norway will be present in the talks, and I hear this meeting is meant only to lay the ground for further talks.. in other words they are going to negotiate about how they will negotiate!…. funny I once read that some time in the 70's when the US and Vietnam decided to negotiate, before the actual talks began they spent 6 months negotiating the shape of the table they where going to sit around!
Yes we need to explore ways and means before we put everything on the table. This meeting validates the fact that Somalia's claims of unity are untrue. Today the IC sits across a table and awaits for two delegations from two different nations. It recognizes Somaliland's concern and that itself is a great victory for Somaliland.
International community now openly recognizes the need for a dialogue and south Somalia's claims of a one Somalia has been thrown out of the window.
Come to the table.
Joe I suspect the IC wants a united and functioning Somalia, and while they will respect the wishes of Somaliland I think they will try their best to sell us the idea of federalism, Just remember the SLand Government does not disclose the full facts because it would be unpalatable to the Somaliland populace and they would be accused of selling us out. I for one think we should have a credible alternative plan B in the event we do not get recognition.
Antonimuspius.
you sound like creature with a good sense & have more understanding Than average s/lander.
IC made it clear it wants somalia intact TFG & s/land addmins were told That before hand so both They just intertianing Their Audiences.
what is plan B ? going back to your isolation kk just joke.
There is no chance of old Somalia before 1991 being revived but im open to a redrawn border between Somaliland and Somalia i.e. ssc regions given to Somalia and rest of somaliland maybe joins Djibouti in a expanded country. But i hope Somaliland including ssc regions can be one independent nation and its imperative hartis and other non-isaak somalilanders can be fully respected and participatory in all spheres of life alongside their isaak compatriots in harmony. let's give hartis the post of prime minister
opinions please
Stop giving us that great Djibouti dream of
Yours !djibouti nor the IC Want this.
Abdiwahab,
Brother we are not interested in joining Djibouti nor are we interested in dividing the ever so mixed and shared lands of ssc. Hartis I believe should have the same equal opportunity and fair share of running for the presidency and or taking their part in the government in an inclusive and democratic government and developing their regions like any Somalilander. We need to sit together and solve our differences in a peaceful manner and address any grievances too as well as negotiating with our counterpart Somalia on our future relation and statehood. I hope something good and positive comes out from this Somaliland-Somalia dialogue
Where ever camels herded in the horn of africa is my land, just like it used to be pre-colonial era. don't thump me down please because i have a dream.
There should be a 10-year break in which Somaliland should gain access to international finance, it's capital Hargeisa should also be given equal status as a joint capital city and the Somaliland be given economic, sovereign, financial, military (as the UN 1992 embargo is removed Somaliland will be able to purchase weapons/arms and modernise our military), diplomatic and mineral and resources independence from south-central Somalia. And after 10 years Somalia should respect a UN-backed referendum of independence in Somaliland, similar to the 2001 referendum held in Somaliland.
Hopefully, Mogadishu should have matured democratically to the level of Somaliland and that S/Land should have economically advanced i.e. re-development on our roads, air/sea ports, mineral exploration/extraction, diversification of our economic etc….
For over 21 years Somaliland has been held back due to the crisis of Somalia. We northerns have equally suffered during the 21 years period due to lack of direct foreign investment.
You absolutely speak for me.
Ali1,
You make good points. Somaliland although it was peaceful has suffered from isolation, lack of direct foreign investment, lack of development, lack of major aids and many more. The plight that fallen on Somalia for the 20 odd years has contributed to the suffering of Somalis as whole and hopefully there is a light at the end of the tunnel to end Somali suffering.
Our first demand should be full statehood with all our borders from east to west independent from Somalia all together. If not then 10 years of sovereign and independent statehood until trust is back between north and south and until Somalia matures democratically like Somaliland and becomes real stable country with strong pillar away from tribal or religious war. Then we can review our case and vote either to go our separate way independent from Somalia or renegotiate on some sort of reunion like you said clearly.
But in my opinion if it becomes based on union still it should never be one state, maybe an equal federal like the UK not like states within state like USA but equal mature countries with own army, own flag, maybe even own currency but with a union flag, union economy and union army from both sides that makes up Greater Somal army. In another words greater Somalia that consist of equal 50/50 federal North Somalia country and South Somalia country and invite Djibouti into the mix if they want. But like I said federal made up of countries and not states. However, I hope full independence from the beginning.
InshAllah something khair will come out from the talks even thought I'm not all excited. I just hope they don't throw chairs at each other in the middle of the talk.
I agree 100% independence first and then if negotiations call for it a union based on sovereign countries similar to tthat of Britain (eg Wales, England and Scotland) all three sovereign nations in a union, I mean how can u make a Somalilander take the blue and white flag when they have their own flag and own national identity and vice versa. I am 20 years old I have not known anything but the Somaliland flag. But yes Union based on different states with their own flags, army, national identity etc is a good last resort
Cony me too, never born into this so-called united somali glory, I'm less than 2 years older than Sl and they telling me to carry the blue flag that I don't know anything about loll but inshallah hope khair. Wish them all the best with the talks. Viva Somaliland
Amal and Colly I was actually born in Sool region and I have never seen any flag other than the blue and white… i am not being qabilist or anything but i cant stand S/land flag… i have been told some greedy thugs brought this unrecognised maro into our city.. (lascanod)
i didnt actually know what Siad barre did to Iss@@q clans untill i made a research. (which was cruel how could government do such a thing to thier civilians) i think somalis lost trust on each other
anyway we can't always be each other's throats and hate each other for what happened ages ago insha'allah khair just like they said wada hadalo waa aan heshiino
As a Somalilander you always have to be just. If as you say Somalland should be given military and financial power then would we not be committing the same ills that the South committed against us during the 1960s union where power was all centralized in Mogadishu.
At the end of the day no union, whether federalism or centralization will work its a 2 state solution, simples. There is no negotiation, even if Silanyo was to propose this he would be forced out, Somalland does not belong to the politicians, diaspora or internet scholars, it belongs to the people who are there who built their country from the ground up. There wishes will be respected by hook or by crook!!!
Kid cartlito, we should fight for full independence how ever possible but if not possible then like Ali said 10 years of full sovereignty and then vote on and if it becomes union which we don't want then the least should be like UK union that consist of seperate countries with their seperate history army flag pride of equals. But before anything else put 100 percent effort to not make it delay any further and fight for our right. But Ali made some good point in the 10 year trial as a last resort before final status
Miss amal, i thought you were 17 or 18y i'm a little disappionted now!
isse,
looool you must be odday :) oday men really like little girls. No, I am an old woman hehehe When I was 17-18 I actually didn't care about Somaliland/Somalia let alone politics. But the funny thing is now kids and youth are so advanced and know so much about qabiil and politics at such young age, cannot believe it lol.
Somaliland's team will address to world at the meeting that Somaliland has a legitimate reason to be a separate entity, based on the following facts: over 21 years was able to established a peace, stability, good governance and rule of law. Unfortunately, Somalia has been going down in the opposite direction in relation to Somaliland at the same length of time, and there's no cloud with silver lining anywhere in the sky over Somalia.
That's been said, the preliminary talks will be very brief because the objectives of the 2 sides are very different so are the expectations. In short, Somalia can move hills but not mountains.
Osman Qaal
Primitive peoples and static civilizations:
In primitive societies, people tend to see the world in a dichotomy of “evil” and “good”, black and white (with no shades of grey in between), or us versus them orientation. In those societies, progress and learning from experiences do not happen and they lead their lives in a fashion similar to previous generations thus they stay backward. For instance for the separatists in northern Somalia, everyone must desire and accept to have an independent country called Somaliland (sic). Any Somali who does not support the separation of northern Somalia from the rest of the country is our enemy. If one opposes the agenda of the separatists and does not see the merit of dismembering Somalia, they are labelled as hateful evil people who deserve to be coerced by force to accept that or if that is not possible, they must be eliminated by one way or another. For them, the situation is not much different from fighting in camel wells; the mighty must win and loot the camels of the vanquished. In fact that is how things were in Somalia since time immemorial and still are. Everyone must file behind the tribe whose members surpass the rest in number. What a shame!
The author of this report does not want to address the very important questions that have to be answered; does everyone in northern Somalia want separation? Why is there a need to divide Somali people? Is there any options to be explored other than division of the country? Why can’t we talk to each other and settle our differences as one people instead of always appealing to foreign parties such as the international community, or the U.K. The writer of this article gives us only one choice – the world must recognize an entity called Somaliland as an independent country and no other option or enough information. People like these authors who relentlessly promote the destruction of Somalia as the world knows it will do everything possible to reach their goal; they will submit their argument as if all the people of northern Somalia were collectively seeking to secede from Somalia while many regions want to be part of a united Somalia. They will beg and beseech anyone and everyone to help them found a country that is controlled by one clan. They will claim the TFG is destabilizing a peaceful northern Somalia, while the reality is that the fighting in that region has never stopped. Kalshaale, Maygaagle and Semaal were not created by TFG. Also, the Transitional Federal Government’s days are numbered as its mandate ends in August and as such is not the right body to either address regional grievances or heal the wounds of the Somali civil war.
Only in the world of savages and children, are problems seen in the simplistic approach of two-value orientation. Roughly speaking, for folks like this author, the world is divided into two types of things that are neatly divided in the middle; those things that frustrate our desires and stop us from achieving objectives whether they are misguided ones or not and those that may gratify us. Simply, their argument boils down to “we are the good guys and the rest are bad and evil. Therefore, good must triumph and evil must be vanquished”. Nonesense.
Since I don’t have enough space here, I want to refute two of the many lies being published in this article such as news and these are:
1.Somaliland fought a war with Somalia and defeated the Somali army and liberated its region. The truth is if it was not the USC and Aideed’s misguided assault on Mogadishu and all the regions in the south, the SNM would not be able to march into Hargeisa and claim a territory. Let us tell the truth as it is. Stop telling these lies to your children.
2.The author claims that Somalia was put under trusteeship of the UN because its people were not fit to govern themselves and that “the UN mandate was terminated only when Somaliland requested that Somalia be given independence so the two could unify under the banner of “The Somali Republic”.
The characterization of the situation of the Somali peninsula this way and re-writing false history shows how desperate are separatists to achieve their misguided agenda of independence. In fact, it is Somaliland that would have remained a British territory if Britain did not see the opportunity to unite Somali people since they believed that Somaliland could not become a viable country and stand on its own. Do not take it for my words. To see the truth of the situation at the time of the independence of Somalia read here http://www.mbali.info/doc120.htm.
nicely put Allemagan even thoe it took me while to read it..
Allemagan while you correctly present some facts, are you yourself not portraying things in the " dichotomy" you oppose, don't you think the "secessionist" have at least some plausible arguments? Would it not be reasonable to claim the final defeat of the Siad regime by the USC was facilitated by the Somali Army being vastly weakened by the SNM? Are you yourself seeing things in simplistic terms i.e Somaliland = Bad or is there more to it than that?
Allemagan.
well written short & effective comment you wrote here telling The TRUTH.
Thanks.
Allemagan,
It all sounds like an old western movie I've had watched it over 20 times in the cold winter months in Canada, specially during X-mas holidays when I feel too lazy of driving over to the video stores nearby and grabbing a few new releases.
Osman Qaal
I am a die-hard, all-out, die-for-Somaliland kinda guy, and I think that the cancer that will consume Somaliland is the un-relentless pursuit of a RECOGNITION………..why do we need to beg for it when the so-called democracies gives us nothing but lip service. That fatefull pursuit for recognition is what is shamelessly taking us back to some baseless and empty dialogue with the ONLY enemy that Somaliland and Somalinders ever had. Politics by nature is a sly job, a job where one sells his/her own soul and where one sleeps with an ardent enemy, therefore, I detest and abhor our (may be they are not ours) politicians for even thinking of talkimg to those who massacred 50-65,000 of our people
@raage
you are the enemy of the somali race.
south Somalis are not the enemy of somalilanders. you are the one who wants to create this emnity by highlighting past mistakes. there is no alternative but to talk talk and talk until we agree. mr Raage your time is up. the time for extrimists who see the only solution is fight stay in the Diaspora because that is properly where you will get old. you just want somalis to revert back to primitiveness and ignorance.
You are our enemies. Stupid Somalis you know you cannot survive without Somaliland. We are the only hope to bring whole of Somalia peace& democracy. Viva divided Greater Somalia :)
if you Think s/land region will be solution to somali problem probably you donkey brain That is all i have say to you.
Hahaha! The real donkey brains are you. Look at your country. It's sh!t and it's full of pirates and Al shabab thugs. If we were in power, you'd have democracy and peace. Thank God Greater Somalia is divided.
Viva division
Wanlaweyn,
Past mistakes? the cost to my people was 50-60000 dead and countless number maimed for life, and for what, may I ask. It is easy to forgive and forget, but the one and only issue that no Wanlaweyn can answer me is, if we were brothers who shared religion, culture, color and language, why the massacre. You and your ilk can talk about far-fetched and imaginary ideals like talk, talk……..as the saying goes "fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me". In Somaali, "mar edage Allah ha dago, laba jeer edagena, anays dagay". So, I say, go talk to others, not us.
NO one is intereting unification some as 1960.
After 1988 Atrocities There are more Than 1.7 million somalis dead.
ALARMING QUESTION: As we all know that , Somaliland dispatched its team to London in order to meet Somaliwayn's team. But their names are not mentioned or posted any where as it appears very suspension one!
Why Somaliland always goes first to state its team's name , is there a catch?
wasirka gadiidka:sanag
wasiirka tacliinta:sool
wasiirka arimaha dibada:awdal
and two mps
this people have the same accent as somalilanders so hopefully you will understand each other
Nabadoon,
To answer your question: Somaliland is politically mature and not afraid of showing the world that we're open for talks with our Somali brothers/sisters if that's what it takes for full fledged international recognition.
Somalis, however, are feared for themselves so if they're suspected in being soft or reasonable as they deal with Somalilanders they might get shot in broad daylight on the streets of Mogadishu.
In addition, Somali politicians will try to hang on Somaliland as much as they can due to the fact they're having more trouble than will ever be able to handle on their own so, they have to use Somaliland as a attention deterrent or perhaps bring to it's knee if possible.
why do Somali politicians meddle with Somaliland's internal affairs?
e.g. K*atumo and SSC were creation of TFG through out of fear as they've realized Somaliland was on it's way for international recognition.
Osman Qaal
Well said. I enjoy reading your posts.
when will u stop telling each other lies,, the title of the meeting is NOT "Somaliland and Somalia".. it is TFG and Somaliland. besides,the world seeks united Somalia so lets how it goes.
**lets see how it goes..
i thought the whole reason somaliland rejected in the first place was because Ilkajir and Daud Bisinle were part of the delegation who orginate (SSC) but yes there are Dhul- ba -hante taking part of this too the minister of education of TFG and other one…
well i can see this is just us reer waqooyi people 3 out of the five other delegation from Sool,Sanaag and Awdal good thing we can all understand each other's accent..
Folks, let's all relax and give it a break through that at long last Somaliland and Somalia TFG
begin to talk in London…to follow up the LCS Feb 23 2012.7 point communique
recommendations. Hopefully this again London meeting will add more positive approaches
with the help of the UK. So you folks take it easy and keep your fingers crossed.
Cheers.
Si y la anyo isnt going to walk away from Somaliland which he fought so hard to bring into existance! lets not forget this guy was on the front lines fighting and sacrificing not only his life but the future of his young family! His story is Somalilands shared struggle to remove ourselves from Somalias tyrannical leaders!
There was already a referendum, two actually. Honestly, I dont see the need for "talks" these idiots have made their position clear go back to si y aads idiot nonsense, or some federal bul l which doesnt serve the wishes of the Somaliland people.
If the Ab g @@l and Habr G had half a brain between them they would recognise Somaliland and forever have a majority rule for themselves in Somalia. But like I said if they only had a brain!
dee Abg@@l and habr G dont share land with u but us.. why are u running away your problems.
i dont know how somali people think.. who cares who rules as long as they are good leaders.
so this is your motivation which i already know. let me break it to you mr bro we the clan you mentioned had a thing with the d44r00d but our desire to set the score with them is not to go as far as to dismember the country. trust me tribalism is not as important in Mogadishu as in Garowe and Hargeisa. this two groups you are mentioning don't know each other and do not should not collaborate beyond the national interest.
Allemagan,
Its true USC did play crucial role in the toppling of Mohamed Siad Bare but the SNM did the majority of the work. USC did not join the war till at the end of 1990s when Siad Bare already moved at least 80% of his military to the north including the hiring of foreign mercenaries after his own forces could not defeat the SNM.
He used Rhodesian and South African pilots flying planes hired for him by UAE and few other Arab States.
He never used mercenaries in the south because he put all his resources in the North so it was a walk in the Park for USC. The only resistance they were met was from Daroods and Rahawein tribes not Siad Bare forces.
Besides USC was not just Aideed; USC was divided into three sections and the SNM supported the Aideed division with military aid and resources. It was the SNM who arranged Aideed's airline ticket from India and facilitated the first meeting between him and Ethiopia. Aideed met small resistance near Beledweyne, once he crashed that it was a home run for him.
The USC was USC-Rome under Dr Jimcale Osoble, USC-Mogadishu led by Ali Mahdi and USC-Ethiopia (SNM ally) led by General Mohamed Farah Aideed.
SNM also drew in the Dir community, particularly the Biyomal which form their own SSNM (Southern SNM).
So if today Somaliland becomes the area only inhabited by Isaakis and Dir, I'm afraid Haawiye will also want to join them in some sort of a new alliance. The SNM-USC alliance is still there.
I doubt calling for Hartis forming under a tribal state with Puntland is a smart move, then Hawiyes will form their own, Dir the same and eventually all three (Isaak, Dir, Hawiye) might agree to an Irir Samale State.
Abdirahman Ali Tuur delivered Aideed a plane load of weapons and the two wanted to form their own government.
Siad Bare already lost control of the north but the USC made huge difference because it cut the last Siad Bare forces the support basically the head was removed from the snake's body.
It was a calculated move by the SNM because it was the SNM who instigated the war between Haawiye and Siad Bare. First SNM made its vice chairman Haawiye, so basically inviting them in, then they started the Irir campaign, then they started carrying out assassinations inside Mogadishu which made foreigners nerves and brought the whole issue to the world's attention. Finally Siad responded by apprehending the Haawiye people, so now they were fully in the rebel side.
SSDF initiated the war, SNM did the damages and USC finished the job. It was like three hyenas attacking one camel :) One Warabe can't claim all credit.
Keyse,
The Haawiye became uneasy of Siad Barre after the atrocities done to the Sacad-HG of Galkacyo as well as the Xawadleh, Gaaljecle and Baadicade in Beledweyn. Then there is the incident of the stadium massacre as well as the wadaads who were executed. It didn't really have to do with SNM instigating a war between Haawiye and Siyaad. But everything else you wrote is accurate.
"I doubt calling for Hartis forming under a tribal state with Puntland is a smart move, then Hawiyes will form their own, Dir the same and eventually all three (Isaak, Dir, Hawiye) might agree to an Irir Samale State"
not very bright are you mr keyse how does hartis compare to irir smale?
more like d44r00d and how can we make alliance while we are in the south?
and why should we trust you again after you chose in 1992 you tribal state instead of finishing of the f4q@sh and stabilize the country?
mr keyse we the "wanlaweyn have passed you tribal state you are stuck in the north and are on the verge of creating a better somalia fit for purpose for all somalis including you.
kayse.
what you wrote here some are right put others are not.
why aideed & tuur never form together a goverment? That is the million dollar question Or just They are not capable.
Walaao, My fellow somali brothers and sisters let us not waist time on the idea of new unity. Somaliweyn is dead just like the former soviet union, therefore let us be realistic and accept the fact that the only practicle solution is a two state solution.
Finally , it is in the best interest of both SOMALILAND AND SOMALIA to accept each other as independant soverign states otherwise we will be in eacher others throat until the dooms day.
"Somaliweyn is dead" i'll be more extreme than you and say (exactly what emperor selassie said prior to Somalia independence) somalis don't deserve to be given their own state, they are nomads they don't know what statehood means. So guys what are we talking about? let everyone go back to their tuulo or village.
Haile salassie haduu naff leeyahay he would have saved himself from what is his name aah Mengisto. did he bury him under his his chair ?
It is in the history books and most of the internatiol human right bodies covered it well that more than 60,000 fleeing civilians were killed within 1988. The aftermath suffering of the following years were countless as cities that existed for centuries old cities were looted. I am a Somalilander and the only thing that could make me forgive Somalia for lost the centimental values of my great grandmother's pictures of her childhood is acknowledgement those crimes against me and my people. Can you bring the weding photoes of my parents and grandparents. If you think as you said time has healed Somalilanders, honestly you get to be joking. I save my historical treasure in way that past experience thought me for my generations to come. Becouse of the ways of Somalia's past and present political immaturity we both suffered. Djibouti didn't. We movedon and mended my wounds. I hope Somalia pulls together. History forgotten is doomed to repeat. I like Somalia liberate itself from humilation of being failed and forieng occupied state.
@ somaliland
We are not the enemies the shaytan who is whispering in your ear is your enemy.
Anas b. Malik reported Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: Neither nurse mutual hatred, nor jealousy, nor enmity, and become as fellow brothers and servants of Allah. It is not lawful for a Muslim that he should keep his relations estranged with his brother beyond three days.
This is about politics, not religion. Somalilanders real enemies are the Somalis a.k.a Pirates/Al shabab thugs. Just let them eat each other off and starve to death. It'd do the world a favour.
I thought in Islam Religion and politics are aligned like like married couples. I thought without
Religion, politics and anything else under the heavenly skies would not work just fine with
the divine laws of mother nature and mother nature didn't just come about without certain
big supreme power. I would leave secular sciences to teach us the true knowledge of this
mother nature super galaxy we humans find ourselves attached to!.
Cheers.
Politics is dirty. You make decisions that may haunt you down. You put yourself in first. You have enemies. You get rid of them and so on. Religion cannot be mixed up with politics. So according to you, we should have sharia law?
Oh oke i thought you were talking about those poor ppl in somalia( women n children) well in tha case pirate/ al shaba are not only somaliland haters but human being haters. FYI Deen is always important to talk about.
I was talking about Al shabab and Pirates. I've got nothing else against the people of Somalia. The only thing I support is division. Religion is important to talk about but not when it comes to politics. It's a game. Dirty game.